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What should i do with the run-off water here?

These two agi pipes bring water from the front garden. A drop of .5-1.5m front to back.

Soil is solid clay. From this discharge point next to the fence the yard drops a further meter to the back fence.

I was thinking of draining the water towards the citrus tree. But water logging is a high risk.
Or drop a leaching tank into the ground. But given the soil profile you can see in this hole below from elsewhere in this garden it’s clay all the way. So I suspect water dispersion from the leaching tank may not be successful. Unless the hole is oversized and filled with gypsum and soil. Is this the best permanent solution?

Advice and practical ideas very welcome please.

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Comments

Jason

Welcome to the Bunnings Workshop community @John57. We're so pleased to have you join us and look forward to reading more about your garden and about all your projects and plans for around the house. We're sure you will get plenty of helpful information, advice and inspiration from our amazing community members.

Apologies for the slow reply. Many of our members are taking a well-earned break at the moment, including our resident Bunnings D.I.Y. expert @MitchellMc. I will ask Mitchell to assist when he returns next week. In the meantime, I appreciate your patience and will tag wonderful members like @Adam_W, @LePallet, @JDE and @redracer01 to see if they might be able to assist.

Thanks again,

Jason

John57

https://www.workshop.bunnings.com.au/discussion/comment/11462#Comment_11462

Thanks Jason and happy New Year.

JDE

@John57

Are you able to link it to your stormwater?

JDE

John57

https://www.workshop.bunnings.com.au/discussion/comment/11479#Comment_11479

Hi @JDE

Unfortunately the storm drain is behind that shed over there 😉

These outlets are diagonally opposite the far back corner of the site and down hill of the storm drain. There is a concrete path as you can see between these outlets and the storm drain over there too.

MitchellMc

Hi @John57,

I wouldn't have thought the citrus would appreciate being that water-logged. You could connect those two solid Ag-lines to a single socked perforated Ag-line. You can then run it backwards and forwards all over the area. This would allow the water to seep out of it over a larger surface area instead of just the one location. If you could take a wide-angle photo of the area for distribution, we might come up with some alternatives.

Please let me know if you need further help or had questions.

Mitchell

John57

https://www.workshop.bunnings.com.au/discussion/comment/11551#Comment_11551

Hi Mitch

These two outlets are not solid agi pipes. They are sock covered slotted agi pipes.

redracer01

Hello @John57

A leaching tank is an excellent idea. However a high concentration of clay in your soil will immediately fill the tank. Looking at your picture I can just make out the water path the rain is making in your garden. I suspect there is a slight slope in your garden causing the rain to pool in this area.

You could :

- dig around the low areas of your citrus and place socked agi pipe in a circular pattern around the citrus trees to redirect the water to the drains at the back.

- create a surface channel drain to redirect the water in case of a downpour. Surface drains are always easier to maintain as it allows you to clear debris by hand. However it is harder to construct.

- re plant the citrus in large pots and recondition the whole area until you get ideal soil conditions.

Either way it will require you to dig to allow the water drain off. Water log canditions will rot the roots of your trees and they will die off.

Below is a picture of a possible cement channel. The channel has to be made in such a way that if water enters it it flows to your cemented area or flows to the drains. It does not need to be uniform it just needs to have the right level for proper water re direction. The lines attached to the channels are smaller channels meant to redirect excess water to the bigger channels. Below is a quick sketch of what you could possibly make.

Red

John57

https://www.workshop.bunnings.com.au/discussion/comment/11562#Comment_11562

Hi RR1

Thanks for your ideas and sketches.

The channel of water flow you see was dug by me. To keep the water away from the fence.

Your pattern is a similar design I suggested to my wife to plant multiple plants around this area.

Under the mulch you see we laid four inches of soil. But I think it isn’t enough for planting except maybe ground cover plants. I could rake back the mulch and add more soil. I’m not fond of concrete as a swale drain. I’d prefer to use another method to disperse the water. There’s no drains at the rear of the property except the far left corner storm water drain as I mentioned is uphill of this area.

what if i ran similar socked agi pipe out under the fence into the reserve on the other side of the fence and let that water find its own way there? May not meet somebody’s regulation drainage requirements though I suspect.

redracer01

https://www.workshop.bunnings.com.au/discussion/comment/68212#Comment_68212

Hello @John57

Putting agi lines near the fence line often causes the posts foundations to soften up and the posts start to lean and sway. I'm not sure about the rules in your area but it would be a pain if you had to fix the fence due to leaning. I know it's a pain but I think you should take back the mulch and place socked agi lines 65mm near the muddiest areas and redirect to the front. Let me ponder a few more days for a better idea.

Red

John57

https://www.workshop.bunnings.com.au/discussion/comment/96992#Comment_96992

There are definitely solutions here, some are more resource-intensive than others.

Create a reservoir and pump the water to the storm drain up the hill by going around behind the pergola and along the back fence uphill to the storm drain.

Running pipe under that concrete path and install another sump this side of the shed before connecting to the storm drain. Requires a reservoir container, and a pump.

I tried installing solid pipe to slotted pipe, well that doesn't work, of course. And water doesn't like running uphill by itself either especially when the pipe behind it is slotted, it leaks lol.

The key issues are the quantity of water and the dispersal of the water. Ok, so the quantity is a constant flow pretty much because when watering the front yard, most is collected as run-off because of the high clay content across the property. Despite us adding a layer of soil, it simply isn't enough to absorb the water, nor is adding gypsum as we have done throughout.

In one area under a heavy-duty vertical screen, I dug out 11/2 ft or 45cm down and filled it with compost soil, to create a garden bed. Damn hard work actually as the clay is lovely and sticky and filled with rocks, overflow concrete, scoria, etc. Nasty job. Got an Air-tasker to help 😉 But this is now a proper garden bed that will absorb water.

Back in the back yard, we dug holes for the citrus, again using good soil and gypsum before planting. But the rest of the backyard is hardened clay with weeds. We took off the weed layer and simply covered it with mulch.

The directions of fall in the backyard are from front to back fence, and from left to right. approx half a meter fall towards the back right corner. There is no easement and the storm drain is located behind that shed, as said earlier.

Imagine saying 'well John, in that backyard, you are going to have to remove the mulch. Then dig one foot of clay and remove it. Then you can fill it by adding 1/1/2 ft of soil, to create a proper growing surface. And drainage will be better as the new area created will absorb water readily.

I am still thinking that the pattern that you have drawn is the way to channel the water for max spread, the question is how to bring the water around like that. Agi slotted sock pipe collects water it doesn't disperse it. And the clay will not drain the water, it will pond. Hence.... here I am.

Oh, and the water pond I've dug there is attracting wasps... to the muddy water that smells...

Thanks everyone for your suggestions and time to help me with this, I am very grateful.

John57

https://www.workshop.bunnings.com.au/discussion/comment/96992#Comment_96992

Yes Red, this is why I ran that river away from the fence.

Before this re-routing, the water simply spilled out towards the fence and down the slope for a few months. I tried digging a delta pattern on the reserve side of the fence to disperse the water. Weeds started to grow and I'd basically constructed a creek! Up that creek...

MitchellMc

https://www.workshop.bunnings.com.au/discussion/comment/115128#Comment_115128

Hi @John57,

If water is directed into a slotted ag-line, it will then leak out of it through the slots along the length. It's not just a one-way system where it only collects, hence my suggestion of using it to distribute. However, it sounds as if you're not confident that even if the water was distributed evenly that it would be absorbed in at all.

I think your best option is a large soak pit that potentially is deeper than the clay layer. You might like to check out our post hole diggers as they would help get you past that clay.

Mitchell

John57

https://www.workshop.bunnings.com.au/discussion/comment/125397#Comment_125397

Good morning Mitch

Did you see the 1/2m post hole photo I posted above.

it’s my basic understanding that the clay goes down to the bedrock.

John

John57

https://www.workshop.bunnings.com.au/discussion/comment/125397#Comment_125397

John57

https://www.workshop.bunnings.com.au/discussion/comment/125397#Comment_125397

I can try agi drain as a dispersal pipe

and yes I’m not convinced that sitting agi pipe into clay soil will achieve anything

looks like a civil engineering problem 🧐

John57

https://www.workshop.bunnings.com.au/discussion/comment/125397#Comment_125397

G’day Mitch and Dear Readers

I am updating this situation and post photos of the final solution adopted.

I had a agi drain installed to channel the water down the slope and out under the fence away from the neighbors yard. Water flows into the reserve to the garden there.

The earlier situation where I had dug a channel towards an orange tree located adjacent to the where the peach tree is now killed the orange tree. Basically too much water. And I’d tried to fix that by digging another channel from the orange tree back to the fence. I’d made a River! That again gave too much water to the tree. So I had to get a proper agi drain professionally installed. Removed the dead orange tree and back fill the hole with clay. Then dug a fresh hole adjacent for the peach tree preparing that with layers of gypsum, soil, fertilizer and created a raised plant that you see there now, protected by sugar cane.

Hope someone finds this useful.

EricL

https://www.workshop.bunnings.com.au/discussion/comment/132793#Comment_132793

Hello @John57

Thank you so much for the update. It's good to see that you've found a solution to your water runoff. Has your drainage solution been put to the test yet? I don't know if you've had some heavy rains in your area, but I'm sure our members are keen to hear if you're still getting puddles in your garden.

Please keep us updated with your progress, we look forward to hearing that your garden is nice and dry.

Eric

John57

https://www.workshop.bunnings.com.au/discussion/comment/136844#Comment_136844

Yes Eric

This was done over a year ago now and is 100% successful in diverting water safely away.

This problem arises because builders leave agi drains unfinished as they are considered landscaping not part of the build.
Others should be aware if they are using agi drains as part of their house build to plan for safe water diversion as part of their landscaping. And be careful who they choose as landscaper. One guy quoted us $5,000 to fix this, with way over engineering his plan including adding sumps running long piping etc.

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