Pre-handover building inspection

Hi everyone.

I bought my first apartment off the plan and it will settle in a few weeks. I've been told that the pre-handover building inspection will be very soon.

I've heard a couple of horror stories from people who had a lot of faults in their apartments that were hard to rectify so I want to make sure I get it thoroughly inspected.

Just wondering if some of the experts here could give me suggestions on what I should be looking for during the inspection? I think I'll be okay picking out faults in the finishing like paintwork and grout etc but obviously want to also make sure I notice anything more potentially serious like plumbing issues or anything that might crack or break over time. Thanks.

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BIM_Engineer

@Kellie
Here's another recent Apartment Horror Story

That I featured on My google community a few days ago

Perth Apart Collapse.jpg

I would also recommend that you get full Documentation

Drawings,Specifications,Engineering Details, Compliance Certificates,etc,etc

Before you sign off/take possession

Final Builders variations should also have been submitted to the Council Building/Surveying Department and certified current.

Rule of Thumb " Compliance to the codes and standards can be certified by a Building Surveyor, If it is found to be non-compliant then it will have to be certified by an engineer as equivalent or better than what's required in Codes or Standards

Please check everything thoroughly

Kellie

https://www.workshop.bunnings.com.au/discussion/comment/2851#Comment_2851

Thank you. Are you saying I should get a building surveyor to check the work?

I hadn't thought of getting documentation beyond the compliance certificates.

BIM_Engineer

https://www.workshop.bunnings.com.au/discussion/comment/63707#Comment_63707

@Kellie The building should be completely checked by your building surveyor for compliance with Codes, Standards, specifications & Drawing. If its found to be non-compliant then depending on the issues it will have to be certified by an engineer.Here in WA Engineers check their own work, if there are changes the plans will be marked up and submitted back to the builder & then council building authority.Avoid documents going missing insist on copies
Here you can get copies of documents from the council..some council charge Several hundred dollars to retrieve them later from archives and if there's a dispute you may not be able to retrieve..
I noticed your building is precast concrete make sure you get the flashing, Stormwater & Plumbing details ..HTH

_Marley_

https://www.workshop.bunnings.com.au/discussion/comment/94368#Comment_94368

Don't the developers do all that for you? Buying off the plan you usually have a contract with the developer so you don't have to deal with the builder if there's any problems, they do.

BIM_Engineer

https://www.workshop.bunnings.com.au/discussion/comment/113571#Comment_113571

@_Marley_You will get marketing colour renderings of the elevation of what it may look like and floor plans & 2 pages of specifications and then the salesman/investment adviser will sell you the BBQ sizzle on the balcony
then you will be asked to sign a contract to buy.. read the contracts
LOL...come in spinner BBQ for dinner

OT Another real-estate residential/sizzling-hot-deals-brisbane-apartments-offered-at-39pc-discount-in-fire-sale

TheFoxSays

https://www.workshop.bunnings.com.au/discussion/comment/124397#Comment_124397

Some great tips here, @BIM_Engineer do you suggest the same for just a housebuild as well? I am assuming so from just reading through these comments here.

My own house is due for insepection in a couple of weeks and this has been helpful in what we should be looking for before they hand it over to us.

BIM_Engineer

https://www.workshop.bunnings.com.au/discussion/comment/131645#Comment_131645

@TheFoxSaysThanks, Yes...you will need to be thorough for new houses as well, generally there is a 3 month maintenance period & 6 year structural warranty. If you require further assistance leave a PM or email, access is granted on google docs..goodluck

BIM_Engineer

https://www.workshop.bunnings.com.au/discussion/comment/136063#Comment_136063

@_Marley & @TheFoxSays
Here is a sobering ABC Report trending on building defects

Leaking Buildings,Mould & Court Battles....

Avoid Salesman selling , BBQs on the balconies, Sizzle & Smoke

as your balcony may become structurally defective

I also discuss balcony waterproofing here

Repairing Balcony spalling suspended slabs

and

Who says you can't have a garden in a city apartment

TheFoxSays

https://www.workshop.bunnings.com.au/discussion/comment/139086#Comment_139086

Thanks @BIM_Engineer, I'll take a look at those articles.

DanB

Hi Kellie,

I bought an off-the-plan apartment and have been living in it for 3 years now. We ended up having 6 family members to come to the inspection with us, including an architect! Fortunately there were few faults compared to other stories I've heard. Some were obvious during the inspection but others we actually didn't notice straight away.

Here's what we found:

- Our frameless shower door opened outwards, but there was a metal towel rail on the wall it opened towards. It seems they had forgot to install a rubber stop on the floor. If we didn't notice and had swung it open with force, it surely would have cracked. The builder fixed this one quickly.

- Several of the soft-close cabinets were missing the soft-closers! If yours have this feature, make sure you open and close all the doors to check they work properly. Again, another quick fix.

- The floor waste in the shower drained very slowly, but of course we only noticed this the first time we had a shower! It turned out the tilers had dumped cement/grout/sand/who knows what down the drain, causing it to be partially blocked. We checked it during the inspection, but only for 30 seconds or so, which wasn't enough time for water to build up in the pipes to reveal the problem. We had to get the builders out a few times before they eventually diagnosed it and fixed it properly, and it hasn't been a problem since then.

- The worst problem was something that didn't actually occur until months later. I'm still not 100% sure what the issue was, but basically, it turned out that the phone cables were connected incorrectly. They worked, but the internet connection was extremely slow, which at first we put down to our ISP. Then all of a sudden it just stopped working altogether. We ended up having to get our own electrician out to fix it because the problem occured just before Christmas, and the builders and the developer were all closed until the end of January. Needing the internet for work, that was far too long to wait! We paid for the electrician out of our own pocket, then spent about three months chasing the developer trying to get it reimbursed, with the developer trying to pass the buck to the electrician who installed the wiring, and the electrician refusing to pay because they expected us to wait a month for them to come and fix it! Eventually the developer caved and reimbursed us themselves. That was a bit unpleasant, especially as nobody would take responsibility for the fault.

Apart from those issues, the apartment has been fantastic and has turned out to be a great investment. Good luck!

DanB

One more thing I forgot! A mate of mine bought off the plan, and his place was pretty much fine, except there was no silicone sealant between the vanity and the splashback in the bathroom.

That building was finished in a big rush as they were well behind schedule, which is something to keep in mind if yours is running late.

BIM_Engineer

https://www.workshop.bunnings.com.au/discussion/comment/141120#Comment_141120

@TheFoxSays& @Kellie @JoshRaf
While we are still on Balconies
Make sure you read this article as well

Balconies, decks & Balustrades

"As a safety measure, all home owners and commercial property owners with balconies, decks and balustrades should ensure that:  It is inspected on a regular basis for any warning signs of potential collapse  A maintenance program is introduced to extend its design life, and  Where there is a doubt or a problem, an inspection by a Structural Engineer or other suitably qualified building practitioner are arranged." Quote

BTW in disputes the Engineer has the final say when it comes to your safety

RenoQueen

https://www.workshop.bunnings.com.au/discussion/comment/139086#Comment_139086

Good discussion! Many thanks for the tips here.

Kellie

https://www.workshop.bunnings.com.au/discussion/comment/141121#Comment_141121

Just as a quick update. I was recommended by a builder to contact ArchiCentre Australia. They got back to me quickly and said they would be happy to do a pre-settlement report for $590. However, the developers have said that the only professional that is allowed to do it is a registered building inspector.

BIM_Engineer

https://www.workshop.bunnings.com.au/discussion/comment/142655#Comment_142655

@Kellie
That's laughable " and who are the building inspectors registered to or members of? most likely the MBA & HIA who represent builders during disputes with clients anyway...IMO there is an obvious conflict of interest there.

Chances are if your building is no-compliant you may well require an engineer to prove that the building is equivalent or better than what was specified in the codes anyway, so you are back to square one
I recommend you get someone independent of the builders organisations MBA HIA , eg. AIA Archicenter or Engineers Australia EA

OT.. Why the VBA Inspections fails the pub test

Contrary to belief the majority of buildings are Non-Compliant

That is to say they don’t meet Current National Construction Codes (NCC) & Australian Standards (AS)

A building surveyor or inspector will recommend making the building/element comply if it's detailed/known or where it can’t be made to comply then the AS says it will need to be certified as “Equivalent or better than what is specified"

Australian Standards deal with Compliance & Non-Compliance specifically in various parts of their respective codes

By Description so if you follow the Instructions/Diagrams it will be deemed as “Tried & Tested” compliant or
Alternatively by Formulae & First Principles/Calculations/Proofs Checked by Engineers
Computer Simulations using software (newer) Checked by Engineers

From My Experience Building surveyors turn a blind eye to non-compliant hard to rectify building engineering elements.my2c

Kellie

https://www.workshop.bunnings.com.au/discussion/comment/143732#Comment_143732

All good, despite the initial email from the developer saying "registered building inspectors only" they were happy with an architect from Archicentre to do the inspection so I've locked it in. Will let you know how I go.

Kellie

https://www.workshop.bunnings.com.au/discussion/comment/144548#Comment_144548

I did the inspection today. Lots of little imperfections which I hope they can rectify but overall very happy. Hopefully the professional inspector hasn't picked up anything major. Thanks again for all of the advice - very much appreciated.

BIM_Engineer

https://www.workshop.bunnings.com.au/discussion/comment/145144#Comment_145144

@Kellie
Glad it all went well 🙂

Kellie

https://www.workshop.bunnings.com.au/discussion/comment/145614#Comment_145614

Thank you. I should get his report today.

One thing that surprised me was the courtyard had large format pavers that had no grout. Instead of a drain the water goes down between the pavers. The architect said it was a good system, although because they were large pavers there was some water pooling on top of them which might get a bit annoying.

BIM_Engineer

https://www.workshop.bunnings.com.au/discussion/comment/145976#Comment_145976

@Jason
Sadly, I read of a Balcony Collapse today in East Doncaster where there were deaths and injuries As a Structural engineer and repair contractor. If anyone needs assistance or preliminary advice on structural matters please take photos, upload them and ask for help. “Better safe than sorry”
OT. In an age of the internet, simulations, data and analysis these deadly collapses are preventable.

Kellie

https://www.workshop.bunnings.com.au/discussion/comment/146276#Comment_146276

That was very sad. Thoughts are with the family and friends of those who died. Hopefully its not a rising problem like today's story suggests http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/doncaster-east-balcony-collapse-could-point-to-rising-problem-says-engineer-20171217-h066d1.html

BIM_Engineer

https://www.workshop.bunnings.com.au/discussion/comment/146520#Comment_146520

@Kellie Actually, Balcony & patio Callapses are common

and it's worse than that article, while Balcony repairs have been discussed before
Repairing Balcony suspended (spalling) slabs
Sadly, it's not until someone is seriously injured or killed that it becomes a controversial topic and all the so called expert and social commentators come out

Call for mandatory inspections after two die in horror Doncaster East balcony 'tragedy'
IMO it's too late then after the event more needs to be done to alert those vulnerable and susceptible beforehand...like property renters.

Kellie

https://www.workshop.bunnings.com.au/discussion/comment/146726#Comment_146726

@BIM_Engineer

I've been in my apartment for a year now and am a bit worried about some of the problems in the building. The body corporate engaged an engineering company to produce a defects report. There are a lot of waterproofing issues causing rising damp, mould, efflorencence, concrete corrosion. Obviously we want them fixed by the builder/developer under our warranty. But I am worried that the builder won't be able to rectify them. Here's some of the photos from the report:

BIM_Engineer

https://www.workshop.bunnings.com.au/discussion/comment/146889#Comment_146889

Hi @Kellie
Waterproofing (specifically lack of) is turning out to be quite an issue in new apartments these days.I recommend you get copies of the original Engineering Drawings & Details .Have your engineers recommended the type of repairs? BTW, you will need to get on to it quickly as you maintenance warranty period may soon expire.

Please leave a PM if you require further assistance

Kellie

https://www.workshop.bunnings.com.au/discussion/comment/147028#Comment_147028

@BIM_Engineer,

We are waiting to hear back from the builder and developer about next steps.

Some of the recommendations in the report included:

- A suitably qualified Civil Engineer to be engaged to review the structural drawings and engineering design of the subject structure and to advise on best remedial measures if required.

- A suitably qualified Plumber to be engaged to inspect all the plumbing (storm water, sewer, main water, waste pipe and fire service) for any possible leaks and the installation and monitoring of a test well on site to check for the presence of a high-water table. It is further recommended a mud map of the pips to be provided by the Plumber demonstrating the exact location(s) of identified leaks and defects in the plumbing system of the structure.

- A damp proofing professional to be engaged to advice on most applicable method of rectifying or installing damp proof course membrane within the brick walls (either physically inserting a new membrane or creating a chemical DPC) to prevent further damage to the walls.

- A Civil Engineer to be engaged to assess the adequacy of the drainage system and their compliance with the relevant Australian codes and standards throughout the structure and advise on the required upgrade works to prevent water from penetrating into brick walls.

- A concrete water proofing specialist to be engaged to advise on the best remediation method for the rising damp issues.

- The damaged concrete columns and walls to be demolished and rebuilt strictly in accordance with Engineering design and specifications and AS3600.

- A suitably qualified Mould Specialist be engaged to determine the extent of mould contamination and treatment of any mould spores.

What is the typical warranty length? I would have thought there is no problem about warranty because a building is expected to last a lot longer than a year without these kind of problems.

BIM_Engineer

https://www.workshop.bunnings.com.au/discussion/comment/147130#Comment_147130

@KellieBTW.. Those specialists/consultants are going to cost you a lot of money should your builder not pay expenses and case for repairs is thrawted
See if you can locate a (Qualified) Structural Repair Engineer/Contractor locally & weigh up your options.
Unfortunately I am in Perth and I am unable to recommend anyone in melbourne...So look around and get 3 quotes for an All inclusive Service
New building maintanance warranty is generally 6-12 months.Goodluck

Isobel

https://www.workshop.bunnings.com.au/discussion/comment/146889#Comment_146889

Oh no @Kellie. You poor thing! I hope those issues get fixed quickly for you.

Kellie

https://www.workshop.bunnings.com.au/discussion/comment/147234#Comment_147234

Thanks @BIM_Engineer.

The body corporate is organising everything as we have 40 apartments in the building and it affects everyone. We haven't had a response from the builder yet.

I've been told there is "a statutory 12 months warranty on most works plus 7 years construction warranties". I'm not sure what the difference is between the two?

Kellie

https://www.workshop.bunnings.com.au/discussion/comment/147029#Comment_147029

Thanks @Isobel. I don't think anything will be quick but hopefully we get a good end result.

BIM_Engineer

https://www.workshop.bunnings.com.au/discussion/comment/147320#Comment_147320

@Kellieunfortunatley I have lost faith in body corporates & Statute Building Laws

Maintance repairs generally refers to 12 months

Structural repairs 6-7 years and if it goes over then read this.

Award-winning Landmark building at charleston has some problems

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