How to add magnets to hold a screen door with self-closer?

We had an OT (Occupational Therapist) assess our house and address issues where my wife, Julie, is struggling.

One area which we examined was screen doors with pneumatic closers - they tend to 'catch' her when she is entering/exiting.

The OT proposed magnetic devices (Maybe These? ) from the ceiling. On the ground they would be tripping hazards.

Would these magnets hold a screen door with a self-closer?

Any thoughts/suggestions welcome.

Cheers.

Hopefully off to Bunnings today to look.

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Comments

twocutekelpies

@Noyade are you wanting to hold the door open or can you get away with making it close more slowly? I believe most pneumatic door closers are adjustable to slow the speed that the door closes. If wanting to hold the door open, I'd remove the closer all-together and rely on manually closing the door as required or engaging the lock on it to hold it open (slide the clip along the arm of the closer) and slide it back to close.

Hope this helps

Shelley

Noyade

https://www.workshop.bunnings.com.au/discussion/comment/60447#Comment_60447

G'day @twocutekelpies

"are you wanting to hold the door open"

Yes. One issue then raised was how does Julie 'release' the magnet once inside. Outside may be easier.

"I'd remove the closer all-together and rely on manually closing the door"

Wind, flies and mozzies are the issues Shelly.

"(slide the clip along the arm of the closer)"

This is physically impossible for Julie. I'm not always home.

But keep those ideas coming. 👍

MitchellMc

It sounds like the OT’s idea definitely has merit, @Noyade, and you are clearly thinking along the right lines by trying to remove anything that could catch Julie or create a trip hazard. A magnetic hold-open system can work with a pneumatic closer, but the key question is whether the magnet is strong enough to overcome the pulling force of the closer. Many standard magnetic door stops are designed for internal doors without closers, so with a screen door closer fitted, it can be a bit hit and miss unless you use something with sufficient holding force. The advantage of your ceiling-mounted magnet idea is that you could potentially add or upgrade magnets until you reach a strength that reliably holds the door open, which gives you some flexibility.

One thing worth thinking through carefully is what happens after the door is held open. Holding it open solves the problem of the door catching her, but Julie will still need an easy and safe way to close it again. If the magnet is overhead and fairly strong, she may need to step back outside to pull the door free, which could defeat the purpose. One possible workaround is adding a simple pull cord or strap to the door handle that runs back to the inside, so she can release the door from the magnet and let it close without having to reposition herself.

Another option that may be simpler is looking at adjustable or soft-close door closers. Some closers allow you to significantly slow the closing speed, so the door still self-closes but does so gently and predictably, which may be enough to remove the risk of it catching her.

Overall, you are absolutely on the right track, and it is great that you are looking at practical, thoughtful changes to make daily movement easier and safer for Julie. A visit to Bunnings to look at magnetic door stops and adjustable closers side by side is a good next step, and you may find a combination of a softer closer and a magnetic hold open gives you the best balance.

Please let me know if you have any questions.

Mitchell

Noyade

https://www.workshop.bunnings.com.au/discussion/comment/60467#Comment_60467

Thanks for your thoughts @MitchellMc.

Back from Bunnings - I'm sure I looked a right idiot in the aisle testing the 'magnetic forces' within plastic packets and against the steel shelving.

I bought a few - but just now tried the Adoored style.

Impressive holding power.

I fitted the magnet as an experiment - I'm holding the door open against the self closer, with ease.

But I'll see what happens when I go with the top of the door against the 'stalactite' ceiling holder.

(Tip : if you buy one of these - no instructions - but you need a large flat screwdriver to undo the base)

Cheers. I'll document my progress.

AlanM52

G'day mate,

If you are interested I should be able to design a voice activated Alexa/Smart Life system 'Alexa... Open screen door' using a wi-fi servo actuator with smart buttons on either side of the door for manual control. The system is also controlled by the phone app. The servo unit has a fail-safe pull ring to mechanically disengage the clutch mechanism in case of system malfunction including power outage. Oh... no electrician required 🙂

Cheers

Noyade

https://www.workshop.bunnings.com.au/discussion/comment/60481#Comment_60481

Sounds wonderful Alan!

Julie lost her job - our income halved.

Strict, strict budget.

I've spent around $15 so far. I already have the steel for my proposed design.

I'd like to see your cost break down for the above - please. 😁

AlanM52

https://www.workshop.bunnings.com.au/discussion/comment/92703#Comment_92703

The tight budget is a tough call but at this early stage I think we can do it.
No need for a cost breakdown the only item purchase is the servo unit about $40 plus materials and I am assuming a DIY guy like you will have stuff like that around the place and you should be able to use the metal plate for the servo baseplate.

To help you start planning...

Here is the servo unit in action controlling the feed cover on my wi-fi bird feeder.

Imagine that mounted in a similar way like a pneumatic door closer.

Question: How come you have such artistic sketching skills!

I'll be back with more info and wi-fi home network requirements.

Cheers

Noyade

https://www.workshop.bunnings.com.au/discussion/comment/112492#Comment_112492

Have you ever seen the animated movie Chicken Run ?

They (your chickens) are probably learning English - "Hey Alexa, open the fence gate and let us out!"

"I'll be back with more info"

Please do @AlanM52

Quick question. Unless the door hinge (fulcrum A) and the servo (fulcrum B) are the in the same vertical plane - isn't the servo just gonna try tearing the door off?

I like your video - you sound like John Lennon. 😁

AlanM52

https://www.workshop.bunnings.com.au/discussion/comment/123782#Comment_123782

I need to watch it again because the first time I fell asleep 😑

Correct and that's what we need to come up with like a sliding connection.

EricL

https://www.workshop.bunnings.com.au/discussion/comment/131231#Comment_131231

Hello @AlanM52

How about adding a pivot arm to the door? This will offset the swinging action and save you from having to build anything complicated.

Eric

Noyade

https://www.workshop.bunnings.com.au/discussion/comment/135793#Comment_135793

Well, I appreciate all the thoughts and ideas.

Thank you.

But at tools down time - 1800 hrs - I have made some progress with the OT's original idea.

Hopefully weld tomorrow.

The excessively long steel plate holding the steel ball - is just in case the magnetic 'grip' is too strong (I suspect not) and then I can move it to the left.

Trial and error.

Cheers.

AlanM52

https://www.workshop.bunnings.com.au/discussion/comment/135793#Comment_135793

Thanks... I will look into that.

Noyade

https://www.workshop.bunnings.com.au/discussion/comment/138900#Comment_138900

Glass of wine.

Another doodle.

And what I'm working with...

New magnet position...

AlanM52

https://www.workshop.bunnings.com.au/discussion/comment/138900#Comment_138900

Glad to see you are making progress...

This year via family and friends I am becoming more involved in the old age thing and developed a interest in disability tech solutions.

@Noyade gave me the idea for the one below to reduce the physical effort for a elderly lady to let her dog out for toilet business.

Hopefully it will work out and she can monitor the back door via a wi-fi camera with Amazon Echo Show in lounge and bedroom.

Tomorrow I will replace the plywood arm with a steel rod and eye screw.

Cheers

Noyade

https://www.workshop.bunnings.com.au/discussion/comment/140991#Comment_140991

Hello @Noyade

"I have made some progress with the OT's original idea.

Actually, you didn't. Today has proven to be a semi-disaster or sorts.

The magnet I purchased is of 'amazing' magnetic strength. In the location I had it, seen above - you almost have to rip/distort the door to free it.

I tried the magnet at mid-door width - same problem.

One thing is certain - it will definitely overcome the tension of the pneumatic door closer - and I have the jumbo version.

Different magnet maybe?

Noyade

https://www.workshop.bunnings.com.au/discussion/comment/142543#Comment_142543

Got there in the end.

I made quite a few mistakes and assumptions along the way that proved to be wrong.

The biggest was underestimating the 'locking' force of the magnet.

So in the end the bracket design and location changed.

Right back to the fascia with the bracket and slightly less than half the width of the door for the magnet position.

Everything nicely balanced - good adherence and a light 'tap/pull' to disengage.

Ultimately - it works well. Julie's happy and so am I.

Cheers.

Jason

https://www.workshop.bunnings.com.au/discussion/comment/143646#Comment_143646

Nice one. We never doubted your skills to work this out @Noyade.

Jason

Noyade

https://www.workshop.bunnings.com.au/discussion/comment/144480#Comment_144480

You have every right to doubt me @Jason. I've made appalling mistakes in life and doing DIY.

Boxing Day Prototype No.2. This one must be anchored to a concrete step/surface.

See how we go after lunch.

Cheers.

Noyade

https://www.workshop.bunnings.com.au/discussion/comment/145099#Comment_145099

When the OT suggested this I could see value.

But each time I asked him what specific items he was thinking off and could he show me examples - he just kept replying, "have a look at Bunnings."

😁

Got there in the end with screen door No.2

Cheers!

JacobZ

https://www.workshop.bunnings.com.au/discussion/comment/145578#Comment_145578

Glad to see you've come up with a solution @Noyade.

I knew you'd get there in the end.

Jacob

Noyade

https://www.workshop.bunnings.com.au/discussion/comment/145950#Comment_145950

Cheers @JacobZ !

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