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How to build entertainment wall with storage under stairs?

Ethel

Hello, I'm looking at creating an entertainment wall next to the staircase, along with enclosing the stairs for storage. I've attached some pictures for reference on what I want to do.

0. Example

2. Timber going from ceiling to floor. I might not put all the way down and put these into pieces to allow for tv to be attached, along with the entertainment unit being attached to the stud timber

4. Blue line - door frame, Green lines - stud frames. Red line - showing extra timber being added to the stud frame and attached to the side of the staircase. This piece of timber would hold the tv mount. Black lines - tv outline & floating entertainment unit

5. Light pink refers to smooth wood veneer attached to stub frames and then slim (3 x 3cm) timber slats sit in front.

6. Shows the underside of the stairs (black line). Smooth wood veneer would either be 1cm or 1.6cm wide and would need to sit flush with the side of the staircase. Red line would be the timber for the stud wall.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

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Ethel

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Ethel

One problem i can see is the timber frame on the underside of the staircase is only 3cm wide. Veneer board likely 1cm and then it would only allow for 2cms out of 7cms for the timber frame to be attached on the underside.

EricL

Hello @Ethel

This is a fantastic project to be undertaking, and your preliminary plans look good. My suggestions are to take your plans to the next stage, and that is to draw the coloured lines into actual timber plans. I recommend starting with the green and blue frame as these will be the bulk of your construction project. Once you've drawn the frames with measurements, I suggest visiting the store or looking at the Bunnings website for timber sizes. What timber size will you be using 70x35 or 90x45? You were mentioning a veneer board, was this plywood or some other timber you wanted to use?

As you quantify the materials of your project, questions are sure to come up. How will you anchor your frame to the floor staircase? How big should the door be? Do I need to add extra support for the TV mount at the back? These are some of the probable questions that might come up.

Let me call on our experienced members @Nailbag, @Dave-1, @Noyade, @DIY4Knuckleheds, @TedBear and @JoeAzza for their recommendations.

Here is a handy step-by-step guide: How To Build A Stud Wall (the techniques used are applicable to your project)

If you have any other questions we can help with, please let us know.

Eric

Dave-1

Good Morning @Ethel

I like your plans and your sketch out of the idea :) I think @EricL is onto a good idea with transferring the lines to the staircase area itself. (I would use coloured tape tho)

Are you going to keep the old hand railing or go with the vertical studs alone like the top pic? If you go it alone then the section of the staircase higher may need something to hold onto.

Im thinking of the side profile of it all. So from the edge of the stair support rail, how much space is there until you are vertically in line with the ceiling (I am presuming there is a beam along the edge under the plaster) Im just trying to see how much space you have to play with.

Cant add much more as you have done most of thinking for it already :) Im looking forward to seeing it unfold as I think it will look quiet modern.

Dave

TedBear

Hi @Ethel this is an interesting project with some challenges to be thought through before you get started.

The timber frame running under the staircase can be made wider by either screwing a piece of timber along its length on the inside (mark where the screws are so you don't screw up into them when attaching your frame) or adding angle brackets on the inside to add support to your frame.

The bigger issue that I see is the operation and size of the door. With backing panel and slats attached, it will be hard to make it swing open. It will need to swing outwards obviously, but if it swings to the wall it can't sit against it without wasting a lot of space. If it swings toward the TV side, the slats will be at right angles and hit the other slats. You will need to look at special hinges that will allow the door section to swing clear of the slatted wall.

The best idea I can think of would be to place your door frame a little bit away from the wall such that the door panel & its slats have a space to sit against the wall when open.

Perhaps you have already come up with a plan to solve this door issue?

Ethel

Thank you for the above advice. And all good questions we need to think about. The door definately needs more thoughts as it will be heavy with teh attached decorative balustrades.

Will be using the vertical rails only and will put a new handrail along the brick wall.

First step is taking off the vertical balustrades & sanding back the slider, along with the steps.

Someone had mentioned that I might not need to build a whole stud frame underneath as the vertical balustrades with the mdf board behind the tv (attaching as decorative border from the front) will take the load of the tv and I can mount the tv mount directly to the mdf board. They have mentioned the vertical balustrades have the anchor points in the floor, ceiling and slider and will handle the load of the tv and entertainment unit. Thoughts?

Dave-1

Good Afternoon @Ethel

Mmmm I think I would prefer to have the stud frame installed first and then the slats. Strength wise over decorative wise. It also means that if you ever go to change the design of the slats (as we do) then the stud wall with covering does not need to be redone. Also for the door, the frame will keep things in line easier.

Dave

JacobZ

Hi @Ethel,

Yes, it would be possible if the battens are structurally rated and they run full height to the floor, however it wouldn't be a good idea to mount your TV to the MDF, you'd want to mount it through the MDF into the battens. If you mount it to the MDF, you are just adding a potential point of failure that should be avoided if possible.

Personally, I think a full stud frame is still a better option though. A stud frame is much better at distributing the load than individual timber battens are because it works as a whole interconnected unit. You can still achieve a similar aesthetic with a stud frame, but you can guarantee it is going to be sturdy.

Jacob

Ethel

Thanks Dave-1 & JacobZ. Will have think about what I'm going to do - will keep busy moving forward.

Day 1 - slats removed along with sanding the steps & slider ready for fresh paint.

Ethel

Day 1

Ethel

I havent taken off these pieces of wood yet. Will they come out easy?

JacobZ

Hi @Ethel,

You've made some good progress.

Timbers of that size are unlikely to be structural in nature; however, it is best to proceed with caution. I'd want to be certain what their purpose was before I removed them. It seems unlikely from what I can see that they are supporting anything above them, but it would still be prudent to confirm this before trying to remove them.

Can you see them from above at all? Or are they completely hidden by the ceiling sheets?

There's a good chance you are going to damage the plasterboard around them by removing them, so it might be best to simply cut out a section of plasterboard and cornice so you can confirm what is going on.

It's impossible to know based on photos alone whether those timbers will come off easily or not. In saying that, it seems likely that they were simply nailed to the stringer as a border for the battens, so I can't imagine they would be too difficult to remove, but some damage to the surrounding plasterboard is likely.

I'll tag @Dave-1, @TedBear, @R4addZ and @Nailbag to see what they think.

Jacob

Nailbag

Hi @Ethel

Thats a great project and is exactly the same as what I'm working on in the planning stages for a mates place. I have also done a couple of timber slatted projects using dressed Tas Oak in the photos below.

But to answer your question, as with @JacobZ its not possible to establish by the photos what purpose those timbers play other than to say they are there for a reason. Unless you're Then. build able to confirm if structural or not, then I would consider boxing them out with dressed but take that all the way across to the left. Then build your slatted frame under. The box-out will then tie in with the new wall.

Nailbag

Dave-1

Good Evening @Ethel

I am also hesitant in removing them as we cant say from the photos what they may be supporting. I really like @Nailbag's suggested solution tho. It will blend nicely and save the issue and potential issues that could arise from cutting the beam. You could always get a carpenter to assess it if you really wanted to remove it.

Dave

Ethel

Thanks Dave & Nailbag.

I'm now also looking at putting timber overlay tread on the original treads as I want to go lighter colour instead of the current dark wood. What type of glue / silicone could I use to stick to the original treads?

Dave-1

Good Afternoon @Ethel

Mmm I havnt had a lot of experience in adding a tread to a stair. Id be more inclined to sand the treads back and see what colour they are and then either oil or coat them in a clear lacquer/varnish. Adding a tread is doable for sure, I would suggest liquid nails but not confident on what should be used on stairs.

Dave

Ethel

Thanks Dave. I've sanded some of the stairs back - not sure what time of wood it is but some type of hard wood. I used a detailing sander and it only removed teh clear coat off the stairs while the stain seems to be a bit deeper.

Could you recommend what time of sander I could try next? Should I use a belt sander or a orbital sander? I've had a look at the edge sanders at Kennards but feel like I wouldnt be able to control this on the stairs with it's weight.

Ethel

Current stair status. I also hand sand the sliders with grit 80 then 120.

JacobZ

Hi @Ethel,

That's a good start, they are coming along nicely.

A belt sander is a strong choice for heavy sanding, but they can be tougher to control than a random orbital sander. If control is a bit of a concern, I would go with a random orbital sander. They are lightweight and easy to control, but you can still put a bit of weight on them to remove material if you need to.

There are some good cost-effective options like the https://www.bunnings.com.au/ozito-230w-random-orbital-sander_p6290233 or the https://www.bunnings.com.au/ryobi-300w-125mm-orbital-sander_p6210549 if you're fine with corded tools. If you wanted to go with a battery orbital sander, then the https://www.bunnings.com.au/ryobi-18v-one-125mm-random-orbital-sander-tool-only_p0371770 and https://www.bunnings.com.au/ozito-pxc-18v-random-orbital-sander-kit-prok-200_p0800111 are good options. Just be aware that if you went with the Ryobi, you'd need to grab a battery and charger separately if you do not already have one.

Let me know what you think and if you've got further questions, please don't hesitate to ask.

Jacob

Ethel

Thanks Jacob. I think I would be fine to control the belt sander with it being a smaller size than the edge sander. Would you recommend a belt sander over the orbital sander? Could I use the belt sander for the heavy sanding and then go over it with the detailing sander if needed?

TedBear

Hi @Ethel, I just saw your query too.

A belt sander can easily dig trenches into the wood if you're not careful (ie if you don't keep it moving) and it will be difficult to get your hands onto both the front and back handles in a staircase situation. I'd definately be using my orbital sander rather than my belt sander if I was in this situation.

MitchellMc

Hi @Ethel,

You can achieve everything a belt sander can with an orbital sander, it just takes a little longer. I can't imagine your stair treads need to be taken back so far that you need to remove a large amount of timber. If you do need to strip them back a bit more aggressively, simply start with a coarser grit on the orbital sander, such as 120-grit, then work through 180-grit and finish with 240-grit for a smooth surface ready for coating.

I'm very comfortable using a belt sander, but I still wouldn't use one on stair treads unless there were deep gouges that genuinely needed removing. One wrong movement with a belt sander can quickly leave a low spot or gouge in the tread, and they can be quite difficult to keep perfectly flat. In most cases, you'd still need to follow up with an orbital sander to refine the finish.

My advice would be to stick with the orbital sander. It's much more forgiving, gives you greater control, and is far less likely to damage your stairs.

Mitchell

Dave-1

Good Evening @Ethel

I was thinking of a belt sander at first, it looks like you can get the nose underneath the tread above however…. and its a big however. If you are not use to using a belt sander I would go for the orbital sander. This is the reason why.

Wayyyy back when I was an apprentice I was taught how to use wood files, I thought it was easy as until I turned in my first "edge" that I had filed.. Yeah it had a slight curve in it. So did my second and third effort. Since then the most common thing I have found with everyone one is we all start with a curve to our filing/sanding.. Your treads dont need to have a rounded edge as it stands out like crazy. Take your time and your stairs will say "Thank you" :)

btw even after using an powered ozito belt sander on my timber deck I still accidently made gouges :) Practice and still sanders can run away.

Dave

Ethel

Thanks for the advice - went out and bought a Ozito Orbital Sander. Here's what 1 step looks like after working on it for about an hour with the sander and hand sanding (also the step I tried paint striper on). I probably need to use a detail sander near the edge of tread and slider.

Do we think this is the best it can get to?

Must be a dark timber instead of a lighter one we originally thought it was. Our end aim is to have it looking like American Oak or Tasmanian Oak but it might be too dark a timber originally.

EricL

Hello @Ethel

I believe you can achieve a better finish. I propose using a lower grit of sandpaper perhaps 80 or 120 grit to really scour the surface clean. If your orbital sander has an oscillating controller or dial set it to the highest level and do a few more passes on the timber surface. Once you are happy with the results finish it off by using a 240 grit to level it back to a smooth surface.

If you need further assistance, please let us know.

Eric

Dave-1

Afternoon @Ethel

It does look like it might end up being a little darker than American Oak or Tasmanian Oak but I agree with @EricL with using some lower grit sandpaper. It will remove more of the surface easier. Then you can go over with a finer grit to make it smoother if needed. Sanding sometimes feels like its getting nowhere fast, until you see it and go "Ahhhhh thats it" :) Its like a sweet spot with effort involved. I have almost given up and staying at a sanded level and then find it in me to put some more time into it. It has always paid off :)

Dave